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stephluvvsyou
Site Admin
Joined: 08 Nov 2007
Posts: 1636
Location: Here!! :)
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 Posted: Mon May 12, 2008 5:32 am Post subject: Harry/Hermione |
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I have a confession to make. I have become the HUGEST Harry/Hermione fan, and it happened extremely fast. (of course I still ship Dasey!!) I think with the break between Season 3 and 4 of LWD I absent-mindedly wanted another ship to keep me company as well.
*Before I go any furthur I must warn everyone that this will be a lonnnnng post.*
Okay so anyways, I've been a fan of Harry Potter for some time now, however, I was not completely absorbed by the world of it. I never used to mind Ron/Hermione, Harry/Ginny. I actually used to really not care. However, a long time ago, I actually made a Harry/Hermione graphic - because I had seen screen caps from the 3rd movie, and thought automatically they were a ship. And I thought, wow they're cute, random graphic time!! (seeing as I hadn't yet gotten into the books or watched the movies at that time.) Someone had to actually tell me that they were not a couple and I was shocked. But I kept the graphic anyway. For some reason I felt really proud of it, lol.
(oh so old, and these are the very first pictures I had ever seen also)
Anyways, my brother rented the OOTP movie, I watched it with him, and I kept making my comments of how Harry kissing Cho was just disastrous for some reason. And no matter how much I tried to find any cuteness in Ron and Hermione's moments, they weren't feeling very right this time around either. I then started talking to my brother (whose a complete fan and has watched the movies/read the books tons of times) about the relationship between Harry and Hermione. I don't know if mentally, saying their names together just sounded too perfect or what because I could not stop talking about them and asking him about them. I was literally starving to see and find every moment they shared together in the books and movies.
So, seeing as I hadn't seen any of the older movies in forever, I went out and managed to collect them all. My brother has the books so that wasn't a problem. The more and more I watched of them together, and read of them together, the more completely in love I fell with them.
The loyalty between them, the respect between them. It's like reading between the lines just like we have to do sometimes with Derek and Casey. Anyways, so I've decorated my youtube page in Harmony, watched some absolutely fantastic videos of them, made graphics (which I'll post) and read some incredible fanfiction.
During one of my fanfiction spurs, I managed to come across a male author, who had some amazing things to say about all the ships, and found that it made complete and perfect sense. His penname is danieljgrant for anyone who is interested in reading his awesome opinions on the matter.
I, by no means have anything against those who ship Ron/Hermione, and Harry/Ginny. I just have an extremely hard time finding those two couples as the proper pairings anymore after seeing the relationship now that is in fact there (even if nobody wants to believe it) between Harry and Hermione.
My thoughts :
Hermione/Ron - cute indeed, and the typical love/hate relationship type thing going on which many people (including myself sometimes) die for. However, what I don't find very cute about them at all, is their inability to actually have chemistry. Really? I don't see hardly any at all. Maybe it's the love/hate that makes them appear compatible, and ultimately sealed their future together. But they just don't...fit. I realize that they end up falling for each other really hard, but...no offense to anyone who ships them...doesn't it seem like they kind of just settled for eachother?
Harry/Ginny - again, cute. But right off the bat I can state for myself that other than them saying 'hi' to each other once in a while, maybe catching them glancing each other's way once in a while...on very...rare ... occassions... um, it's almost as if their relationship came right out of the damned blue. Sure, Harry saves her in the Chamber of Secrets, but if anyone thinks that means anything romantic, let's just recap how many others he's saved, and maybe that's romance as well. Seriously, I know as well that he thinks about her a good amount in the 6th and 7th books, but unless there was some inbetween the scenes, kind of behind closed doors, relationship building? Did they wake up one morning and just decide that they were destined? Sheesh...*rubs head because she just doesn't understand*
Harry/Hermione - and then we have this beautiful couple. A hero and heroine. They save each other. Loyal beyond all imagining to each other.
These two have the kind of relationship that is most real. They stick together through the worst and best situations. Take the 7th book for instance. Ron, (who is a loyal friend to Harry, but not in this particular part) takes off and leaves out of anger. Leaving the girl he supposedly loves, and his best friend alone. Hermione, doesn't even chase after the boy she supposedly loves, she stays with Harry. Until the end. She mourns over Ron while he is away, however, she still remains with Harry. Those are the signs of just a plain loyal, and strong friendship, however, I believe with all my heart, that she probably feels safer, and more understood with Harry.
Now is the chemistry, which is an exploding amount. Hermione needs someone who understands her, who will discuss what she reads in her books with her, who will tease her once in a while to lighten up, and let her know that she is a big help, that all her hard studying isn't for nothing. She produces results out of that. Harry has filled in every area.
Harry needs someone who will also understand him, who will never betray him no matter what other people are saying, who will face everything with him and be his strength, who will laugh at him when he's underneath an invisibility cloak, and allow him to face what he has to face. Someone who will stress to him that they refuse to let him go it alone, that even if it means being in danger, hurt, or death, it is worth it to them to be by his side. Hermione has filled in all of those areas.
I also don't believe in that load of crap excuse that they love each other like siblings. I think they've been forced somehow to feel that way. (i have another entire seperate rant about this.)
There are millions of other things I could say about them but this post is terribly huge already. Anyways, I want to know everyone else's thougths on the Harry/Hermione relationship. I really do believe that if they'd have been the ones ending up together, it would have been beautiful, and made much more sense.
I will share my graphix with everyone, but come on! I wanna discuss this couple!!!
If any of you are shippers of Harry/Hermione, and want to use any of the graphix I've posted, please remember to credit, and leave my tag on the graphic as well. I'm very proud of my hard work on these and would be crushed if anyone tried stealing them!
Anyways, can't wait to read some other thoughts on this!!
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xscarsxofxreminence
Dasey King/Queen
Joined: 18 Dec 2007
Posts: 384
Location: In your force field.
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PinkJelly
Obsessed With Dasey
Joined: 20 Jan 2008
Posts: 1122
Location: Good Ol' Toronto Ontario
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| Posted: Mon May 12, 2008 4:23 pm Post subject: |
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OMG, that was amazing.
Harry and Hermione was actually the first thing I've ever, ever shipped, through them, I came across fanfiction, and fell head over heels in love. Though I am now more of a dramione fan, Harry and Hermione will always have a special place in my heart.
Everything you said was true, Daniel and Emma has incredible chemistry, Emma and Rupert? Eh, not so much. Like you said, I admit they're cute with their bantering, but they don't challenge each other, they don't make each other better, and there's really no respect in their relationship at all.
HP is probably one of the best fandoms out there, the people are usually nice, kind, and very talented. I spent about 2 years of my life in it, and I'm still connected to it in some ways. They're just amazing.
And even though I do like Harry and Ginny, I believe in the love potion theory, it just doesn't seem likely that love potions would be brought up so often without any major use...
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innocently_ironic
Dasey Fan
Joined: 17 Apr 2008
Posts: 59
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| Posted: Mon May 12, 2008 8:28 pm Post subject: |
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I COMPLETELY agree with everything you said. I'm a huge Harry/Hermione shipper, and they do have a certain "read between the lines" thing going on. The couple is all about subtleties, loyalties, understanding, love, and crazy CHEMISTRY.
Hermione/Ron:
| Quote: | | But they just don't...fit. I realize that they end up falling for each other really hard, but...no offense to anyone who ships them...doesn't it seem like they kind of just settled for each other? |
I definitely agree. In my opinion, they lacked the chemistry needed to pull of a perfect love/hate relationship. Furthermore, I really thought that they brought out the worst in each other at multiple times throughout the book. And hurt each other's feelings as well. Derek/Casey may bicker and banter but they never actually try to hurt each other's feelings...and if they think they did then they'll immediately do something sweet to fix it. I never saw that with Hermione/Ron. It seemed to me like Ron just liked Hermione because he figured out she was an attractive girl and he'd known her for so long. And with Hermione, I really didn't even think she "liked liked" Ron at all until Book 6. And even then, it felt like she liked him (for no particular reason) and hated that she liked him and that brought out the worst in her. In that book she was all over the place because of her jealousy and was not even thinking clearly enough to help Harry at certain times when he needed her. I agree...it really seemed like they both kind of just settled for each other.
Harry/Ginny:
| Quote: | | But right off the bat I can state for myself that other than them saying 'hi' to each other once in a while, maybe catching them glancing each other's way once in a while...on very...rare ... occassions... um, it's almost as if their relationship came right out of the damned blue. |
I agree. It DID come out of the blue. I'm all for reading-inbetween-the-lines but there were BARELY any lines for me to read between. They barely spoke to each other until Book 6 and 7. And, although, yes they are cute... I really don't understand why Harry falls so hard for her. I don't think that she's the perfect girl for Harry (as J.K. Rowling kept saying). Hermione is definitely his match, and the one that's been with him from the beginning.
Once again, I felt like J.K. was just trying to wrap everything up into One-Big-Weasly-Family without actually giving much thought to anything else romantic-compatibility-chemistry-wise.
Harry/Hermione:
Exactly. Harry and Hermione have such a REAL, mature, and deep relationship. They are the one relationship that I could actually see lasting past grade-school. They understand each other in a way that no one else can, they are always there for each other, and they love each other unconditionally. Hermione is, above all else, his equal. Harry supposedly loved Ginny so much that he wouldn't let her go with him, Ron, and Hermione on their journey. But he loves Hermione just as much, he's known her since they were kids, every important event in his life he has experienced with Hermione by his side, his love for her transcends "romantic love"...but yet, he lets Hermione go with him. It's because she's his equal, and he regards her as such.
I also agree with you about the siblings thing. It's a load of crap. They do not have sibling-chemistry at all, nor do they act that way. They act like a couple who have been together for years, who can understand each other without needing to speak words, and who are completely comfortable with each other.
Love your artwork, btw!
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spiffyPAJAMAS
Dasey Shipper
Joined: 03 Jan 2008
Posts: 138
Location: Chicago, IL
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| Posted: Tue May 13, 2008 1:20 am Post subject: |
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I'm drizzling.
(You know, like, raining on the parade? Except I'm just making a comment, I'm not trying to go on a rampage..nevermind, I need sleep.)
The sixth book of Harry Potter is basically my bible. Which makes up for the seventh book sucking so much that I actually wanted to burn it. (I was feeling a combination of hysterical amusement and anger while reading the epilogue. It was so terrible.)
Just, the jealousy and hatred Ron and Hermione have in the sixth book is so...guh. But I'm just a hardcore love/hate fan that I love two people who care so much about eachother and yet have to deny that and rip eachother apart. It makes me happy. Yeah, I'm twisted.
Anywho, back to the topic: I DESPISE Harry/Ginny. Oh man, that was so pointless. Gr. I've always had a fascination with Harry/Tonks (due to my even more extreme dislike of Tonks/Lupin because the movies scarred me) ever since the fifth movie. Tonks is younger and she obviously has a small crush on Harry, so it just interests me. Shipping it? Not so much. I've always enjoyed Luna/Harry as well. But whatever.
Either way, the seventh book turned me off from the HP series. (And honestly, I really don't care for JK Rowling after that Lexicon thing.) So I really don't care who ends up with who. Ron was a jerk in the seventh book. Harry should have died. Hermione should have ended up with... I don't know, Draco. Neville. Whatever.
Oh, and one thing to add: I have always thought of Harry and Hermione as brother and sister. They're like Veronica and Wallace in Veronica Mars, which tested my loyalty when there was the chance of them becoming stepsiblings. Even then, I still stuck by that V/W were BFFs and that was that. I mean, if somebody did ship them? They'd be quickly mauled by people saying they were idiots.
Obviously, the H/Hr biz is different, but I still would be creeped out if they got together. Once again, I honestly don't care either way, just adding my opinion because I'm talky on sleep deprivation.
Wow, that was long. I should just lock the forums from myself when I'm this loopy.
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innocently_ironic
Dasey Fan
Joined: 17 Apr 2008
Posts: 59
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| Posted: Tue May 13, 2008 2:38 am Post subject: |
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| spiffyPAJAMAS wrote: | | I was feeling a combination of hysterical amusement and anger while reading the epilogue. It was so terrible. |
The epilogue read like a predictable fanfic. 
| Quote: | | ... and yet have to deny that and rip each other apart. |
See, but that's the thing about RHr ... they don't HAVE to deny it and rip each other apart, they just choose to.
Spike/Buffy - She was a Vampire Slayer, he was a Vampire with no soul ... so yes, they HAD to deny the feelings because the union would go against everything the other one stood for. It was socially unacceptable.
Derek/Casey - (although I consider them more "bicker/banter" then "love/hate) - They are step-siblings ... and thus, socially unacceptable. If I felt even a inkling of feelings for a semi-family member than I would try my best to push it away and deny it.
Ron/Hermione - Are ... friends *and* both in the wizarding world. Their union would be completely socially acceptable. So they have no reason to rip each other apart and constantly put down one another. They do it because they happen to bring that side out in one another. (Of course this is just my opinion, obviously you have a different one and I respect that )
| Quote: | | (And honestly, I really don't care for JK Rowling after that Lexicon thing.) |
Are you talking about the Mugglenet interview? Because I completely lost my respect for her after that. I thought it was completely unprofessional for an author to mock, insult, and laugh at a certain portion of her fanbase (harry/hermione shippers)
| Quote: | | Ron was a jerk in the seventh book. Harry should have died. Hermione should have ended up with... I don't know, Draco. Neville. Whatever. |
Agreed. When Harry was walking to his "death", I thought that was the perfect ending for him. It was poetic and just ...perfect. But then she wimped out and had him live and end with that cheesy epilogue (seriously, those kid names? Seriously?!) As for Hermione ... I really don't know why she would've had to end up with someone from her grade school. People do sometimes end up with people they meet outside of highschool, you know?
| Quote: | | Oh, and one thing to add: I have always thought of Harry and Hermione as brother and sister. They're like Veronica and Wallace in Veronica Mars |
I'm going to have to disagree on this one. Harry/Hermione are absolutely nothing like Veronica/Wallace. Yes ...I'm sure that someone out there ships V/W romantically, but there are MILLIONS of people who shipped Harry/Hermione (not as much as RHr fans...but still a lot). If Harry/Hermione had purely brother/sister chemistry then they would have a tiny tiny fanbase like Veronica/Wallace. Instead there was TONS of Harry/Hermione fansites, music videos, forums, etc etc. I even knew a lot of very casual readers who had just read a couple of the books, ask me if Harry and Hermione end up together or not. So it definitely is no where near comparable to Veronica/Wallace since I have yet to see multiple V/W romantic vids, sites, or forums. Just my opinion though ... lol |
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spiffyPAJAMAS
Dasey Shipper
Joined: 03 Jan 2008
Posts: 138
Location: Chicago, IL
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| Posted: Tue May 13, 2008 10:55 pm Post subject: |
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Wow, my post got broken down. I feel so special. (: (Weird things make me happy.) I shall do the same, because I find a gap of time with nothing to do, and this quoting business excites me.
| innocently_ironic wrote: | | Derek/Casey - (although I consider them more "bicker/banter" then "love/hate) |
I have to say, bicker/hate might just be my new favorite saying. Thanks for introducing me to that, I've never heard it before. I have to agree, considering Derek and Casey are so close now... -sigh- They should just get together, they're not fooling anyone.
| Quote: | | Ron/Hermione - Are ... friends *and* both in the wizarding world. Their union would be completely socially acceptable. So they have no reason to rip each other apart and constantly put down one another. They do it because they happen to bring that side out in one another. (Of course this is just my opinion, obviously you have a different one and I respect that ) |
Yeah, I know, I tend to ship romantic pairings that have no real foundation. (I think R/Hr is the only canon I ship now-a-days. That, and Dasey. Dasey is canon, it's simple.) Of course, I don't know about most other people, but I tend to deny someone if I like them. I wasn't saying that they were acting like it was forbidden, they just hated eachother so much in the beginning that I think they felt like it would be wrong to change that. Plus, their trio with Harry would have been messed up, so they were putting Harry into the mix. Either way, Ron was stupid. That was probably the reason it took them so freaking long. That boy is dense.
| Quote: | | Are you talking about the Mugglenet interview? Because I completely lost my respect for her after that. I thought it was completely unprofessional for an author to mock, insult, and laugh at a certain portion of her fanbase (harry/hermione shippers) |
I might, but I'm not sure. I'm talking about how JK Rowling is [suing? I don't think so] that guy who's trying to publish a Harry Potter Lexicon, and she doesn't want him too. I find that truly jaded, because I would be ecstatic if someone cared about my work so much that they put that much effort into something about it. I mean, that guy worked tirelessly to do it, and she simply doesn't want to let him because she says Harry Potter belongs to her. It's selfish.
| Quote: | | Agreed. When Harry was walking to his "death", I thought that was the perfect ending for him. It was poetic and just ...perfect. But then she wimped out and had him live and end with that cheesy epilogue (seriously, those kid names? Seriously?!) As for Hermione ... I really don't know why she would've had to end up with someone from her grade school. People do sometimes end up with people they meet outside of highschool, you know? |
THANK YOU! THANK YOU THANK YOU THANK YOU! Wasn't it timed so perfectly? Harry dying and then Neville killing Voldemort? Neville being the hero was so foreshadowed and it was perfect timing, but blah, she killed it. I bet her intention was originally to kill Harry, and she chickened out. That's why the ending sucked. [About who Hermione pairs up with] Haha, yeah, I know, but it's more exciting to pair Hermione up with someone random in the series than Bob who never appeared. I would have laughed so hard if she ended up with Draco, though.
| Quote: | | I'm going to have to disagree on this one. Harry/Hermione are absolutely nothing like Veronica/Wallace. Yes ...I'm sure that someone out there ships V/W romantically, but there are MILLIONS of people who shipped Harry/Hermione (not as much as RHr fans...but still a lot). If Harry/Hermione had purely brother/sister chemistry then they would have a tiny tiny fanbase like Veronica/Wallace. Instead there was TONS of Harry/Hermione fansites, music videos, forums, etc etc. I even knew a lot of very casual readers who had just read a couple of the books, ask me if Harry and Hermione end up together or not. So it definitely is no where near comparable to Veronica/Wallace since I have yet to see multiple V/W romantic vids, sites, or forums. Just my opinion though ... lol |
Like I said, it was a really rough comparison. I was just comparing them using my opinion, not really factoring anyone else's. I think V/W and H/Hr have the same type of chemistry, IMO. Obviously, other people don't think the same thing.
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stephluvvsyou
Site Admin
Joined: 08 Nov 2007
Posts: 1636
Location: Here!! :)
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| Posted: Wed May 14, 2008 4:34 am Post subject: |
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Wow there is alot of response here! Makes me happy!!!!!! Lol.
Where do I even start?
| Quote: | Wow steph all of the graphics are AMAZING! Gahhh. So cutte.
Hehe. I mean, Im not ever a H/Hr shipper and I still love them.
Have you considered posting them to http://community.livejournal.com/harryhermione?
Im sure they would love your graphics! |
Thanks Paige! I definately will check them out. And I'm glad you enjoyed the graphics!!
| Quote: | OMG, that was amazing.
Harry and Hermione was actually the first thing I've ever, ever shipped, through them, I came across fanfiction, and fell head over heels in love. Though I am now more of a dramione fan, Harry and Hermione will always have a special place in my heart.
Everything you said was true, Daniel and Emma has incredible chemistry, Emma and Rupert? Eh, not so much. Like you said, I admit they're cute with their bantering, but they don't challenge each other, they don't make each other better, and there's really no respect in their relationship at all.
HP is probably one of the best fandoms out there, the people are usually nice, kind, and very talented. I spent about 2 years of my life in it, and I'm still connected to it in some ways. They're just amazing.
And even though I do like Harry and Ginny, I believe in the love potion theory, it just doesn't seem likely that love potions would be brought up so often without any major use... |
I wanted to point out - that I think you floored Ron and Hermione's relationship with the best explination yet - there's really no respect in it at all.
I couldn't agree more. I realize that they have a strange kind of relationship - it's funny in ways that kind of make me see more so than anything - that the love is not there.
And the Harry/Ginny love potion theory...it seems very real to me as well.
| Quote: | I COMPLETELY agree with everything you said. I'm a huge Harry/Hermione shipper, and they do have a certain "read between the lines" thing going on. The couple is all about subtleties, loyalties, understanding, love, and crazy CHEMISTRY.
Hermione/Ron:
Quote:
But they just don't...fit. I realize that they end up falling for each other really hard, but...no offense to anyone who ships them...doesn't it seem like they kind of just settled for each other?
I definitely agree. In my opinion, they lacked the chemistry needed to pull of a perfect love/hate relationship. Furthermore, I really thought that they brought out the worst in each other at multiple times throughout the book. And hurt each other's feelings as well. Derek/Casey may bicker and banter but they never actually try to hurt each other's feelings...and if they think they did then they'll immediately do something sweet to fix it. I never saw that with Hermione/Ron. It seemed to me like Ron just liked Hermione because he figured out she was an attractive girl and he'd known her for so long. And with Hermione, I really didn't even think she "liked liked" Ron at all until Book 6. And even then, it felt like she liked him (for no particular reason) and hated that she liked him and that brought out the worst in her. In that book she was all over the place because of her jealousy and was not even thinking clearly enough to help Harry at certain times when he needed her. I agree...it really seemed like they both kind of just settled for each other. |
Exactly! They bring out the worst in each other, and they do hurt each other's feelings. I think this is one of the major reasons I don't ship them is because REAL love/hate relationships have a let up somewhere in the hate part. But they go through every book like hate/hate almost, you know? I must admit in the 7th when Hermione is torn up over him leaving, and Ron gets torn up over her undergoing the crucio curse countless times from Beallatrix (i can never remember how to spell her name lol), that we finally see some care. But for those small moments compared to the series as a whole? I went through thinking...'okay they're supposed to end up in love? What the hell?'
| Quote: | Harry/Ginny:
Quote:
But right off the bat I can state for myself that other than them saying 'hi' to each other once in a while, maybe catching them glancing each other's way once in a while...on very...rare ... occassions... um, it's almost as if their relationship came right out of the damned blue.
I agree. It DID come out of the blue. I'm all for reading-inbetween-the-lines but there were BARELY any lines for me to read between. They barely spoke to each other until Book 6 and 7. And, although, yes they are cute... I really don't understand why Harry falls so hard for her. I don't think that she's the perfect girl for Harry (as J.K. Rowling kept saying). Hermione is definitely his match, and the one that's been with him from the beginning. |
I don't understand either how on the green earth Harry could have fallen so hard for Ginny. I wish I could ask Rowling herself this actually, cause this situation actually bothers me. She is in no way the perfect girl for Harry, however, in my opinion and as I think I stated the same about Ron and Hermione, maybe Harry just decided to settle for her.
| Quote: | Once again, I felt like J.K. was just trying to wrap everything up into One-Big-Weasly-Family without actually giving much thought to anything else romantic-compatibility-chemistry-wise.
Harry/Hermione:
Exactly. Harry and Hermione have such a REAL, mature, and deep relationship. They are the one relationship that I could actually see lasting past grade-school. They understand each other in a way that no one else can, they are always there for each other, and they love each other unconditionally. Hermione is, above all else, his equal. Harry supposedly loved Ginny so much that he wouldn't let her go with him, Ron, and Hermione on their journey. But he loves Hermione just as much, he's known her since they were kids, every important event in his life he has experienced with Hermione by his side, his love for her transcends "romantic love"...but yet, he lets Hermione go with him. It's because she's his equal, and he regards her as such. |
Hermione is definately his equal. I believe that Harry knows that. And I cannot get past just how awesome it is, the loyalty between them. You put it perfectly : they understand each other in a way that no one else can, and they have experienced everything together. Every emotion, dangers, happiness. He finds Hermione so worth it, and so brilliant, that sometimes it makes me wonder if he ever felt she was too good for him?
| Quote: | I also agree with you about the siblings thing. It's a load of crap. They do not have sibling-chemistry at all, nor do they act that way. They act like a couple who have been together for years, who can understand each other without needing to speak words, and who are completely comfortable with each other.
Love your artwork, btw! |
Amen sister, about the sibling thing. I realize that siblings can be loyal and close, however, they still go their own ways, lead their own lives. Harry and Hermione are very involved with each other. Hermione especially craves to be by Harry's side through everything. And I'm glad you liked the graphics!!!
| Quote: | I'm drizzling.
(You know, like, raining on the parade? Except I'm just making a comment, I'm not trying to go on a rampage..nevermind, I need sleep.)
The sixth book of Harry Potter is basically my bible. Which makes up for the seventh book sucking so much that I actually wanted to burn it. (I was feeling a combination of hysterical amusement and anger while reading the epilogue. It was so terrible.)
Just, the jealousy and hatred Ron and Hermione have in the sixth book is so...guh. But I'm just a hardcore love/hate fan that I love two people who care so much about eachother and yet have to deny that and rip eachother apart. It makes me happy. Yeah, I'm twisted. |
May I just admit here, that I'm totally with you about the 7th book. I believe that it was alright, but definately could have been loads better.
Ron and Hermione's whatever it was in the 6th book was almost annoying to me. I thought the jealousy issues were ridiculous. I mean, really they were so busy trying to out do one another, and hurt each other more than the other, that they were almost out of character. (Hermione to me, especially). I was seriously wondering why Rowling wrote them in that way. And Hermione causing Ron to do better in Quidditch? Come on now...I found that extremely out of character for her, even if she's got the interest in Ron. The Harry/Hermione bickering...ugh.
| Quote: | | Anywho, back to the topic: I DESPISE Harry/Ginny. Oh man, that was so pointless. Gr. I've always had a fascination with Harry/Tonks (due to my even more extreme dislike of Tonks/Lupin because the movies scarred me) ever since the fifth movie. Tonks is younger and she obviously has a small crush on Harry, so it just interests me. Shipping it? Not so much. I've always enjoyed Luna/Harry as well. But whatever. |
In all honesty, since Harry/Hermione just seemed out of Rowling's abilities, I'd have rather Harry ended up with Luna instead of Ginny. Because even so there, I feel Luna would have understood him more. And that's what he needs I believe more than anything. Ginny...barely knows the kid. She's been like, a fangirl of his through most of the series.
| Quote: | | Either way, the seventh book turned me off from the HP series. (And honestly, I really don't care for JK Rowling after that Lexicon thing.) So I really don't care who ends up with who. Ron was a jerk in the seventh book. Harry should have died. Hermione should have ended up with... I don't know, Draco. Neville. Whatever. |
I honestly was expecting Harry to die in the last book. It seemed like that's really what it was aiming at. He survived, which does make me happy anyway, but after the future he gets set with? I was thinking...is that really what Harry wanted? Or Rowling herself? I think she did get a little sloppy with the end of the last book. It was almost like she got out of touch with her own characters.
| Quote: | Oh, and one thing to add: I have always thought of Harry and Hermione as brother and sister. They're like Veronica and Wallace in Veronica Mars, which tested my loyalty when there was the chance of them becoming stepsiblings. Even then, I still stuck by that V/W were BFFs and that was that. I mean, if somebody did ship them? They'd be quickly mauled by people saying they were idiots.
Obviously, the H/Hr biz is different, but I still would be creeped out if they got together. Once again, I honestly don't care either way, just adding my opinion because I'm talky on sleep deprivation.
Wow, that was long. I should just lock the forums from myself when I'm this loopy. |
I understand posting when overtired. I've done it so many times. Lol, when I used to have time to stay online more often I would go back the next day and read things from the night before and be like...whaa???
I...really just can't bring myself to see that they act in any way sibling-ish. And that maybe because we ship differently, but it just seems very unrealistic. Obviously, by the 7th book, Harry does look at her like a sister, he admits it to Ron. However, if Ron hadn't been in as a love interest for her? Do I believe Harry would see her in that manner? Definately not. I believe Harry and Hermione both sort of just got used to saying such things because they seemed unavailable to each other. Just my opinion tho! lol.
| Quote: | | See, but that's the thing about RHr ... they don't HAVE to deny it and rip each other apart, they just choose to. |
I strongly agree with this. It's almost as if they're miserable, yet they're going to settle for it anyway because somehow they're used to it. Which is sad.
| Quote: | | I'm going to have to disagree on this one. Harry/Hermione are absolutely nothing like Veronica/Wallace. Yes ...I'm sure that someone out there ships V/W romantically, but there are MILLIONS of people who shipped Harry/Hermione (not as much as RHr fans...but still a lot). If Harry/Hermione had purely brother/sister chemistry then they would have a tiny tiny fanbase like Veronica/Wallace. Instead there was TONS of Harry/Hermione fansites, music videos, forums, etc etc. I even knew a lot of very casual readers who had just read a couple of the books, ask me if Harry and Hermione end up together or not. So it definitely is no where near comparable to Veronica/Wallace since I have yet to see multiple V/W romantic vids, sites, or forums. Just my opinion though ... lol |
I'm not familiar with the Veronica/Wallace pairing...
However, Harry and Hermione do in fact have a huge fanbase, which is awesome in itself, because like you said, if they did seem like it was only brother/sister chemistry - then the fanbase would be much smaller. It seems like there are hundreds and thousands of people out there who don't think they behave as brother/sister, nor have that kind of relationship by any means.
You guys are all awesome! I hope more people join this discussion because it's been a blast, and I respect all opinions, I just love to debate, so I'm glad that you guys have jumped into this with me!
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opaldragon
Dasey King/Queen
Joined: 01 Jan 2008
Posts: 355
Location: Windfall island (from Zelda: the wind waker)
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| Posted: Sat May 17, 2008 4:50 am Post subject: |
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I agree with everything you said Steph  I'm a HUGE Harry/Hermione shipper, and I just never saw the chemistry between Ron and Hermione. (And I don't disrespect Hermione/Ron shippers.)
Last edited by opaldragon on Wed May 21, 2008 5:25 am; edited 1 time in total |
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onefineday
Dasey Shipper
Joined: 26 Jan 2008
Posts: 112
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| Posted: Sun May 18, 2008 1:33 pm Post subject: |
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I read the books for the first time this past summer after my friend dragged me to the OOTP movie, shortly before DH came out. I knew this girl who was a huge H/Hr shipper, so I read the books expecting that, but I saw nothing but very deep friendship. I'm much more of a Ron/Hermione shipper. I am not in any way arguing so don't worry. 
I really liked your thoughts on Harry/Hermione. It's always good to hear the other side's opinion. I loved how well-developed it was. I can see why people ship Harry/Hermione, mostly because I think Ginny is an awful match for Harry. To whoever brought up the love potion theory, I was always curious about that as well. Harry did describe Ginny's smell an awful lot in that book.
Honestly, I find the chemistry argument very subjective. Some people ship Harry/Hermione, some ship Ron/Hermione. Just like some ship Derek/Casey, while others ship Max/Casey (god knows why). The world never seems to agree, and the world never will. (Sorry for such a random insight.)
I personally always saw Hermione as a mother figure to Harry. Maybe not quite, but she always looked out for him and at times, he lied to her and avoided her much like he would to an authority figure. That is one big reason why I can't see the two together romantically. There are several others, but that's one of the main ones.
I'm curious why you feel as if they were forced to act as brother and sister. I'd love to hear your thoughts, even if they are a rant. I hope there's no Ron bashing involved?
I also had a few responses I wanted to make. I don't mean anything as an argument, I'm just pointing out a few things I thought while reading everyone's posts. I hope no one minds. Feel free to pick apart my post as well.
| innocently_ironic wrote: | | And hurt each other's feelings as well. Derek/Casey may bicker and banter but they never actually try to hurt each other's feelings...and if they think they did then they'll immediately do something sweet to fix it. I never saw that with Hermione/Ron. |
Um, Derek and Casey never tried to hurt each other's feelings? I think it's more so that they hurt each others feelings, but when they see the other one hurt, they feel guilty and make things better. A perfect example would be when Casey sabotaged Derek's chances with Kendra, but then helped the two get together in the end.
I don't think Ron and Hermione are without those moments. They fought in POA about the firebolt Harry was sent, which Hermione turned in, and Crookshanks "killing" Scabbers. Hermione refuses to apologize; Ron refuses to approach her until she does so. Those two are very stubborn. I don't remember the exact scene, but Ron eventually comes to his senses when he sees how torn apart Hermione is with all of her schoolwork, the Buckbeat case, etc. To help her out, he kind of takes over the Buckbeak case himself.
As to why Derek and Casey resolve things soon after the fact... I think there is a lot more room to escape at Hogwarts than there is in the McDonald/Venturi household. Plus, their siblings are much more involved whereas Harry is more passive. Plus, on LWD most things are resolved in the half an hour show whereas the books are a lot longer.
| innocently_ironic wrote: | | It seemed to me like Ron just liked Hermione because he figured out she was an attractive girl and he'd known her for so long. |
Boys are clueless. Ron especially. And I don't think Ron suddenly noticed her when she became "attractive." I think the feelings were underlying, but it was mostly Krum's appearance that made him take a closer look at Hermione. And by a "closer look" I mean at her as a person in relation to him, not her looks personally. Of course, this is just my opinion.
| innocently_ironic wrote: | | And with Hermione, I really didn't even think she "liked liked" Ron at all until Book 6. And even then, it felt like she liked him (for no particular reason) and hated that she liked him and that brought out the worst in her. In that book she was all over the place because of her jealousy and was not even thinking clearly enough to help Harry at certain times when he needed her. |
As for when Hermione first started liking Ron, I personally thought that happened in GOF. That's just me though and I do not expect you (or anyone) to agree.
However, I agree with you. Book 6 truly was awful, relationship-wise at least. It didn't really fit after the fifth book IMO. Yes, Hermione was jealous, but she would never put her jealous above her friendship with Harry and her willingness to help him out. (Although Harry was a bit distracted in HBP as well).
I thought she was much more in character in DH when she chooses to stay with Harry. Actually, I hate using the word chooses to describe it. There was never any choice to make.
Hopefully it seemed like there was a point somewhere in there and it didn't feel like me spouting off random things. |
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innocently_ironic
Dasey Fan
Joined: 17 Apr 2008
Posts: 59
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| Posted: Sun May 18, 2008 8:03 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | I personally always saw Hermione as a mother figure to Harry. Maybe not quite, but she always looked out for him and at times, he lied to her and avoided her much like he would to an authority figure. That is one big reason why I can't see the two together romantically. |
I would say that Hermione was the "mother" type figure for both of them, in terms of always bringing in the realistic/logical/rational element to their thinking, and trying to be cautious where the boys were not.
| Quote: | | Um, Derek and Casey never tried to hurt each other's feelings? I think it's more so that they hurt each others feelings, but when they see the other one hurt, they feel guilty and make things better. A perfect example would be when Casey sabotaged Derek's chances with Kendra, but then helped the two get together in the end. |
I disagree. There is a definite difference between trying to hurt someone and trying to play a prank on someone. Derek never tries to intentionally hurt Casey's feelings, he just likes to play pranks on her and he knows which buttons to push to do so. His actions don't usually result in her crying, they result in her getting angry at him and retaliating. If by some chance they do actually result in her crying then he will make amends. As for Casey with Kendra, she hadn't known Derek that long and really had never seen him genuinely have feelings for a girl. So, no, she wasn't trying to hurt him ... again, she was trying to pull the ultimate prank on him. When she learned that he actually could like Kendra, she amended it right away. Ron and Hermione knew each other for a long time prior to Book 6 and knew that each other had feelings and could be hurt. Therefore, they cannot use the same excuse that works for Derek and Casey.
| Quote: | | Yes, Hermione was jealous, but she would never put her jealous above her friendship with Harry and her willingness to help him out. |
I'll have to respectfully disagree. Right after I read the book, I actually assembled a list of quotes that fit Hermione putting her jealousy above her friendship with Harry. Although, I don't have that list anymore nor do I want to go through that book again. But I remember a specific scene where Harry was trying to talk with Hermione, but she was so caught up in her jealousy that she ended up leaving him there...standing in the snow. And in the end of the novel, Hermione was glaringly missing from Harry's side. Even after Dumbledore died, it was Ginny who was by his side...but it should have been Hermione (for purely friendship reasons). The old Hermione would have been the one who was there for Harry at that time, who had always been there for Harry in times like that ... but she was very obviously missing. Just my opinion, though ;D
| Quote: | | However, Harry and Hermione do in fact have a huge fanbase, which is awesome in itself, because like you said, if they did seem like it was only brother/sister chemistry - then the fanbase would be much smaller. It seems like there are hundreds and thousands of people out there who don't think they behave as brother/sister, nor have that kind of relationship by any means |
Agreed. If the Harry/Hermione relationship was so obviously platonic and brother/sister then the HHr fanbase would be a lot smaller and less passionate about their beliefs.
| Quote: | | It's almost as if they're miserable, yet they're going to settle for it anyway because somehow they're used to it. Which is sad. |
Exactly. It is very sad. It's like they feel jealousy with each other, but hate that they have those feelings ... so they just succumb to those feelings and are together. Which is fine for short-term, but for the long-term it's not a good way for a relationship to start.
| Quote: | | I think she did get a little sloppy with the end of the last book. It was almost like she got out of touch with her own characters. |
I agree. It was as if she catering more to the fans than to her own novels' literary merit. In fact, the Ron/Hermione pairing doesn't even fit in with the novel's style ...
...The pairing was a classic love/hate highschool relationship in which they got together in the end. However, her novels were based heavily on symbolism, references from classical works, red herrings, subtleties, motifs, etc. And if you've read some of the amazing essays that came out examining the Harry/Hermione relationship, there is a lot of connections to all of those things in the novels (whether she intended them to or not). As far as plot goes, JK Rowling never took the "obvious" route. However, that's one thing RHr is known for, among fans of the couple, ...known for their "obviousnes". It's sad that she dedicated so much thought and provided depth to her storyline, but yet chose this obvious/typical romance for her novels. There was great potential where Harry and Hermione was concerned, and I think if she would've followed where the writing had led her then she would have utilized that potential. That's one thing that bothers me about some writers...they won't allow themselves to go where the story naturally takes them (even if unexpected), some writers will just strictly stick to their original plans even if organic new situations/relationships have taken on their own life in the story.
| Quote: | | Harry and Hermione are very involved with each other. Hermione especially craves to be by Harry's side through everything. |
Agreed. She doesn't just crave to be by his side through everything, but she has to literally be gripping his arm (digging her nails through his shirt) and holding on to him through everything that he experiences. lol
| Quote: | | Hermione is definately his equal. I believe that Harry knows that. And I cannot get past just how awesome it is, the loyalty between them. You put it perfectly : they understand each other in a way that no one else can, and they have experienced everything together. Every emotion, dangers, happiness. He finds Hermione so worth it, and so brilliant, that sometimes it makes me wonder if he ever felt she was too good for him? |
I think that you might just be right about that last part. Plus, as soon as Ron displayed feelings for her, I think Harry just sort of wrote the possibility off...since he would never want to steal Ron's crush. But outside of highschool, once they all matured, I definitely believe that realistically Harry would've saw Hermione in a new light.
| Quote: | | And the Harry/Ginny love potion theory...it seems very real to me as well. |
It seems like a very real possibility to me as well That's one thing I didn't like about the Harry/Ginny relationship and her supposedly being "perfect for him" ... she was mostly just his fangirl (whether admittedly or not) throughout most of the novels. And when she wasn't a fangirl, she still barely spoke to him, except for recently. She couldn't possibly know him as deeply or as well as would be expected for her to all-of-a-sudden be his perfect match. She couldn't have known the real-Harry at the point of their getting together, and therefore I felt the relationship lacked the necessary build-up which could've been done (seeing as JK had 7 whole books to possibly build it up).
| Quote: | | They bring out the worst in each other, and they do hurt each other's feelings. I think this is one of the major reasons I don't ship them is because REAL love/hate relationships have a let up somewhere in the hate part. But they go through every book like hate/hate almost, you know? I must admit in the 7th when Hermione is torn up over him leaving, and Ron gets torn up over her undergoing the crucio curse countless times from Beallatrix (i can never remember how to spell her name lol), that we finally see some care. But for those small moments compared to the series as a whole? I went through thinking...'okay they're supposed to end up in love? What the hell?' |
Exactly! I really thought that the relationship lacked the necessary build-up it needed to justify an acceptable love/hate relationship. It was definitely more hate than love up until the 7th book where they actually showed some care for each other.
| Quote: | | I might, but I'm not sure. I'm talking about how JK Rowling is [suing? I don't think so] that guy who's trying to publish a Harry Potter Lexicon, and she doesn't want him too. I find that truly jaded, because I would be ecstatic if someone cared about my work so much that they put that much effort into something about it. I mean, that guy worked tirelessly to do it, and she simply doesn't want to let him because she says Harry Potter belongs to her. It's selfish. |
I agree, it's selfish. JK Rowling really doesn't seem to understand that the interpretation of her works are not owned by her. Although, I was actually talking about a separate interview she had with mugglenet, where she laughed/mocked/insulted the entire HHr fanbase by calling us "delusional" and laughing profusely at the thought that we existed (and much more). But again, it's the same issue as the Lexicon guy ... she can't accept that she doesn't own how people interpret or choose to display their interpretation of her novels. If you're a writer then once you publish the book ... your done. The work is open to interpretation, and even if you hadn't intended it to be interpreted in a certain way, you cannot flat-out reject those who interpreted it as such. Oh and as far as the Dumbledore being gay thing? I have nothing against it personally, but ... if it wasn't in the novels then it wasn't canon (IMO). Sure, she may have intended certain things to happen or wrote with certain things in mind but if it is not literally in any of the novels then it's not canon. So next year she may tell us how every Friday Hermione secretly watched Soap Opera's when she was supposed to be studying ... but if it didn't make it to print, then it's just not canon in my opinion. |
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onefineday
Dasey Shipper
Joined: 26 Jan 2008
Posts: 112
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| Posted: Mon May 19, 2008 6:30 am Post subject: |
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| innocently_ironic wrote: |
| Quote: | | Yes, Hermione was jealous, but she would never put her jealous above her friendship with Harry and her willingness to help him out. |
I'll have to respectfully disagree. Right after I read the book, I actually assembled a list of quotes that fit Hermione putting her jealousy above her friendship with Harry. Although, I don't have that list anymore nor do I want to go through that book again. But I remember a specific scene where Harry was trying to talk with Hermione, but she was so caught up in her jealousy that she ended up leaving him there...standing in the snow. And in the end of the novel, Hermione was glaringly missing from Harry's side. Even after Dumbledore died, it was Ginny who was by his side...but it should have been Hermione (for purely friendship reasons). The old Hermione would have been the one who was there for Harry at that time, who had always been there for Harry in times like that ... but she was very obviously missing. Just my opinion, though ;D
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I don't have very much time so I can't reply to your whole post, but I just had to say this.
I don't think I was very clear in my response because I meant to say that I completely agreed with you on that point. I didn't mean that Hermione didn't put her jealousy above her friendship with Harry in the sixth book because that is exactly what she did. What I meant was that even if Hermione was jealous, she was the kind of person who would never put that above her friendship with Harry. The way she reacted in the sixth book didn't fit Hermione's character. It wouldn't have taken her practically the whole book to figure out who the Half-Blood Prince was (well, at least the family he came from). She was too preoccupied with her jealousy to concentrate. That is not Hermione at all. Hermione, Ron, Harry, and Ginny all bugged me in that book because the way they acted was completely out of character, or their actions were just simply intolerable.
And I agree with you one hundred percent about Ginny, which is why it bugged me that in DH when Harry was walking to the forest to his death that he thought of Ginny, not Hermione and Ron. I was never convinced about Harry/Ginny. |
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innocently_ironic
Dasey Fan
Joined: 17 Apr 2008
Posts: 59
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| Posted: Mon May 19, 2008 6:05 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | The way she reacted in the sixth book didn't fit Hermione's character. It wouldn't have taken her practically the whole book to figure out who the Half-Blood Prince was (well, at least the family he came from). She was too preoccupied with her jealousy to concentrate. That is not Hermione at all. Hermione, Ron, Harry, and Ginny all bugged me in that book because the way they acted was completely out of character, or their actions were just simply intolerable. |
Oh, lol, so we agree then...because I was definitely talking about Book6!Hermione. And I agree that she was very out of character, because the old Hermione would've never let her jealousy/feelings come before her friendships. And like you said, book 6 reflected poorly on a lot of characters...but it is also the book (imo) that made Hermione's feelings for Ron canon. Which is a part of what I disliked about the relationship...the fact that JK had to take the characters so out-of-original-character in order to focus on the RHr relationship/Hermione's feelings. If a writer has to do that in order to make something work then the relationship/storyline and/or character is being forced. 
However, I will say this, in Book 7 I was much more convinced of RHr (and saw them in a more positive light) then I did in any of the books previous to that. I just wish she would've built them up properly throughout all 7 novels, instead of (bicker, hate, bicker, little-bit-of-love, bicker, hate, jealousy, LOVE) ... it just wasn't balanced compared to the build-up of the Harry/Hermione relationship/friendship (platonic or romantic, depending on how you interpreted it).
| Quote: | | And I agree with you one hundred percent about Ginny, which is why it bugged me that in DH when Harry was walking to the forest to his death that he thought of Ginny, not Hermione and Ron. I was never convinced about Harry/Ginny. |
Yeah, that bugged me too. Ron and Hermione were always the two peers that Harry cared most about; and who both knew him better than anyone else. Harry and Ginny didn't exchange more than a few lines to each other up until Book 6, and when they did get together they didn't even make it past the "honeymoon"/lovey-dovey/infatuation part of the relationship before Harry had to break up with her because of certain circumstances. So you're definitely right, if Harry thought about anyone while walking to his death, then it should have been the two people who have shared and experienced everything with him, the two people who have seen him at his greatest/worst/angriest/happiest, and the two people who had loved him even before he was this "boy wizard who had escaped Voldemort on multiple occasions". |
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onefineday
Dasey Shipper
Joined: 26 Jan 2008
Posts: 112
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| Posted: Tue May 20, 2008 5:03 am Post subject: |
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| innocently_ironic wrote: | | Oh, lol, so we agree then...because I was definitely talking about Book6!Hermione. And I agree that she was very out of character, because the old Hermione would've never let her jealousy/feelings come before her friendships. And like you said, book 6 reflected poorly on a lot of characters...but it is also the book (imo) that made Hermione's feelings for Ron canon. Which is a part of what I disliked about the relationship...the fact that JK had to take the characters so out-of-original-character in order to focus on the RHr relationship/Hermione's feelings. If a writer has to do that in order to make something work then the relationship/storyline and/or character is being fo |
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